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Posted: Tue Dec 24, 2013 1:09 pm
by darren
This deleted sequence, I always assumed it came before Steed meeting Forbes which seems to be after the briefing session (both have the REMAK writing on the blackboard).
Although there's some good stuff in the episode, I felt the loss of Tara/Linda. Forbes was too much a Emma Peel substitute by Clemens who hated Tara. I've warmed to the character since, in a large part due to Jennifer Croxton being so lovely on the commentary.
Visually it's quite a tatty looking episode. Cliff Owens direction is very stylish but the sets and chosen locations are a bit naff.
6/10
Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2013 11:32 am
by Frankymole
MikeR wrote:anti-clockwise wrote:You know it is too bad that we can't see the original scripts. It really would be interesting to see how it evolved. The Girl from Auntie is a great example. According to Roger Marshall what he wrote ( which unfortunately he can't recall) does not resemble what he wrote.
That makes a lot of sense Mike but it would be so wonderful if we could see it in writing.
There are quite a number of scripts that are now missing and some of this is down to the official copyright holder, who I'm sure was Weintraub Entertainment at the time (the late 80s), deciding to reduce paperwork. As a result they foolishly hired a company to transcribe all the scripts thay had into dialogue sheets, which reduced the amount of paper. However, the saving was minimal and the end result was that the original screenplays were discarded.
Hence the chance of obtaining scripts for the series now probably lies with people who worked on the show.
IanBeard said on Roobarb's that: "From what I've heard the situation is even worse - at some point it was decided to save space again by putting the transcript copies onto microfilm, but that was done in such a slipshod manner that pages were skipped, the blank side was copied, pages were folded meaning info was missing, etc. And then the physical paper was sent to waste.
"Then, a few years later it was decided that, "Yes, we do need paper copies" - so now they have scrappy sheets taken from poor microfilm of what wasn't even the original paperwork in the first place."
Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2013 12:16 pm
by MikeR
Frankymole wrote:MikeR wrote:anti-clockwise wrote:You know it is too bad that we can't see the original scripts. It really would be interesting to see how it evolved. The Girl from Auntie is a great example. According to Roger Marshall what he wrote ( which unfortunately he can't recall) does not resemble what he wrote.
That makes a lot of sense Mike but it would be so wonderful if we could see it in writing.
There are quite a number of scripts that are now missing and some of this is down to the official copyright holder, who I'm sure was Weintraub Entertainment at the time (the late 80s), deciding to reduce paperwork. As a result they foolishly hired a company to transcribe all the scripts thay had into dialogue sheets, which reduced the amount of paper. However, the saving was minimal and the end result was that the original screenplays were discarded.
There are horror stories regarding how Weintraub handled the Associated British Picture Corporation archive (including The Avengers) before selling it on several years later. The archive was held at Pinewood Studios at the time (surprisingly not Elstree Studios) and the staff, who in some cases had worked with it since Associated British Picture Corporation days, were made redundant.
Hence the chance of obtaining scripts for the series now probably lies with people who worked on the show.
IanBeard said on Roobarb's that: "From what I've heard the situation is even worse - at some point it was decided to save space again by putting the transcript copies onto microfilm, but that was done in such a slipshod manner that pages were skipped, the blank side was copied, pages were folded meaning info was missing, etc. And then the physical paper was sent to waste.
"Then, a few years later it was decided that, "Yes, we do need paper copies" - so now they have scrappy sheets taken from poor microfilm of what wasn't even the original paperwork in the first place."
There are horror stories regarding how Weintraub handled the Associated British Picture Corporation archive (including The Avengers) before selling it on several years later. The archive was held at Pinewood Studios at the time (surprisingly not Elstree Studios) and the staff, who in some cases had worked with it since Associated British Picture Corporation days, were made redundant.
Posted: Thu Dec 26, 2013 4:44 am
by anti-clockwise
That is one sad story. It sounds like you guys should have been in charge and all of us would have the old scripts.
Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 12:55 am
by John Johnson
One of my favourite episodes of the series, mostly because of Jennifer Croxton. It's a pity we never saw more of Lady Diana Forbes-Blakeney.
Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2014 2:12 am
by Frankymole
Yes, it would've been interesting if she'd been introduced earlier - I wonder how she would have got on with Emma Peel? Rather like the planned three-handers for season 2 which never came off (I always wonder what Cathy would've made of Venus Smith, or Venus of Dr Keel/King). I suspect Emma would've been quite snooty about her.
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 4:41 pm
by Lhbizness
I enjoyed this episode - Lady Diana Forbes-Blakeney is marvelous and has a nice, easy rapport with Steed (as was mentioned, she's basically Emma Peel Redux). The "house/building designed as a killer" motif is done a LOT in The Avengers, sometimes to excellent effect (House that Jack Built) and sometimes less so (Complex). But this one I think worked, even if I could have done without the repetition of agents being killed in the same way.
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:22 pm
by Frankymole
I found Lady Diana rather cold, aloof and snooty - each to their own I guess!
Repetitive deaths for the first two acts (until Steed 'n' partner track down the repetitive killer) are something of a trope of the colour seasons, sadly. Rodney's right that the narrower pool of writers makes this more formulaic.
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 5:35 pm
by Lhbizness
I didn't find her particularly aloof - I like the scene where they split a drink before going after the bad guys. She might seem cold when compared with Tara, though - but she's very capable. She's got that subtle Englishness that sometimes comes off as cold (Steed and Emma have it too), but I think the actress gives a one-off character a good dose of warmth and intelligence.
Game suffers from the same problem of repetition - the characters might not be aware of what's happening, but the audience is aware and it gets boring.
Posted: Sun Mar 30, 2014 6:31 pm
by Timeless A-Peel
People always cite Forbes as an Emma throwback, but she never seems particularly Emmaish to me. She has the standard Avengers woman qualities, but beyond that I don't see a great deal of similarity between them. Perhaps she was meant to be an Emma knock-off, but she feels like her own character to me.
I don't mind Forbes, but I think they could have done a bit more with her character, even within the confines of the one-episode stint she was given. Steed christens her Forbes, and then never actually gets to call her that! There are lots of little threads that they hint at for her backstory, but the episode doesn't really explicate on any of them, which is frustrating. I really wish she'd gotten a second episode, because I feel like the character had potential that wasn't realised the first time around. Jennifer Croxton gives her all, though--she even sprained her ankle doing her fights.